viral panel / immunological approach

Discussion in 'Your Living Room' started by Irelandman, Feb 5, 2012.

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  1. Irelandman

    Irelandman Guest

    SS, if one is going to use the above mentioned approach what should one ask for when approaching their GP to get referred to a virologist and immunologist?
  2. June-

    June- New Member

    Is this currently the standard approach of most specialists ? Is this a readily available option for most people? I ask because I don't think it is in the united states. Do you know of anyone in the US who have had their doctor offer these tests? If so would you tell us who and where so interested people can pursue this?
  3. June-

    June- New Member

    Would you point us to publicly available research that shows that there is a better outcome for patients whose doctors who offer no treatment without these tests as compared with patients whose doctors proceed without these tests?
  4. hollymm

    hollymm Me, 'in' a tree.

    Another topic I gotta follow...why so damn many topics about the very same thing? I'm trying to keep up, but, damn!
  5. June-

    June- New Member

    Actually, it's optional. :D
  6. hollymm

    hollymm Me, 'in' a tree.

    true dat, true dat...
  7. hollymm

    hollymm Me, 'in' a tree.

    I'm thinking you didn't answer the question June asked. Where are the doctors that automatically perform the tests you suggest as a base line of information to have? Why aren't these tests concurrently performed along with all the tests the specialists already have in place? Is it new input you give that directs the doctor towards a treatment option the individual has that is afflicted with Meniere's? Does it have something to do with what you've done for yourself which ended in a cure for people who have a viral infection or immune related response?
  8. June-

    June- New Member

    How do you know that a positive on a certain test correlates with a viral etiology for a patients menieres and how do you know a negative guarantees their mm is not viral in origin ? Just a lawyer's common sense or are their studies that show this correlation?

    How does the patient benefit more from this panel of tests than just by trying an antiviral to see if the antiviral helps them? This is the approach that most doctors take? I see where the panel of tests would help a researcher with his project but I don't see how it helps the patient when antivirals are such a relatively innocuous drug. What I think it does is make it harder for patients to try antivirals because the chance that their doctor will do all you suggest is necessary is pretty much nil.
  9. John of Ohio

    John of Ohio New Member

    June, you nailed this matter right to the wall. Just how many prescription antiherpetics are there? Two, three, maybe four ( Acyclovir, Famvir,and Valaciclovir)?

    What evidence has anyone presented to show that an expansive series of immunological tests for either viral antibodies or immune system molecules either correlate with specified antiherpetic efficacy or eventually provide greater symptomatic relief?

    No evidence has been presented that even a single American ENT clinic or practitioner uses or administers the comprehensive panel of tests Mr. Spring so strongly recommends.

    On the other hand, there is now abundant evidence that simple administration of antiherpetics, in the absence of the serological tests recommended by Mr. Spring, will frequently provide welcome symptomatic relief.

    A good body of the published evidence of the efficacy of the straight adminstration of antiherpetics is listed here:,22570.0.html

    --John of Ohio
  10. otter95

    otter95 New Member

    The true value of the test is not in confirming positive/negative results from a single test, but rather from a establishing a baseline and repeating the test over time to compare the results before vs. after treatments. Given the tendency for Meniere's to go into remission, as a patient I want to objectively confirm that the treatment is working rather than rely solely on subjective evaluation of my symptoms. And I'd want to know when I can safely taper down or stop the treatment altogether. It's not just for the benefit of a researcher in a lab.
  11. otter95

    otter95 New Member


    You have acknowledged that there are cases where individuals gain partial, but not complete relief from your regimen. There are many studies that show incomplete results from antivirals. It is plainly obvious that in many cases, something more is needed to bring about full relief. The immunological aspect that Stephen presents may very well be the missing piece in those cases. You won't find American ENTs doing this simply because the technology is relatively new and had not previously been applied to cases of Meniere's disease. Why not wait and see how effective this approach becomes as more studies are done before dismissing it? Meanwhile, people can keep on trying your regimen and antivirals.
  12. June-

    June- New Member

    Most viruses go dormant on their own. I don't see how the tests will tell you that the treatment made the virus go away. It also won't tell you if the virus is what was causing your inner ear problems. I don't think it will tell you anything as these viruses are extremely common in all people. Imalsomdont think you will find a doctor who will go along with this. My first priority for myself was to rid myself of the godawful symptoms rather tha prove anything. I leave that to the research doctors and I am glad for their work but I don't want to endure symptoms u til I fit into their research project. I am patient first, guinea pig second.
  13. bulldogs

    bulldogs New Member

  14. John of Ohio

    John of Ohio New Member

    Of course, each is welcome to his own approach to his own case of Meniere's.

    You state that "The immunological aspect that Stephen presents may very well be the missing piece in those cases [where relief is incomplete]." But how, exactly, will immunological testing afford any additional relief? How is the physician or patient to respond to the test results? They don't offer any new antiherpetics or other therapies, only documentation of some immunological state.

    Why make the expenditure of time and funds merely to learn of an immunological state for which there is no additional treatment? What, per chance, can or should be done with the immunology results that isn't being done with straight antiherpetic treatment? In essence, what new or additional treatment is there after the immunology results are known? Why test if the test results provide no useful treatment options?

    Specifically, what are the additional treatment options, beyond straight antiherpetics, that might result from detailed immunological testing? Those options have never, to my knowledge, been presented here. What do we suggest the physician do with immunological testing results, beyond what he might already have done with symptom-indicated treatments?

    There has been a great deal of dancing around extensive immunological testing, but with no indications of what a virologist or physician should do with those results to reduce or eliminate a patient's Meniere's symptoms.

    We need some clarification on this murky point. After the tests, what are the new treatment options? Those have never been stated in any useful detail.

    --John of Ohio
  15. John of Ohio

    John of Ohio New Member

    But Stephen, you haven't answered the crucial question: What, specifically should the patient or physician do with immunological test results? It appears their only useful function would be to determine that the patient's immune state is effectively dysfunctional and nothing further can or should be tried to control a basal, causative virus.

    It appears that the only usefulness of the tests would be to confirm that nothing more could be done to treat the Meniere's' symptoms yet remaining.

    I ask again, what specific treatment(s) might the expanded testing indicate? An example?

    --John of Ohio
  16. June-

    June- New Member

  17. June-

    June- New Member

    Please tell us exactly what test result would indicate to you that a virus is involved in the Menieres and what test and test result would indicate that it is not. Using Epstein Barr as an example, what test and test result would prove to your satisfaction that it is involved in the Menieres and would call for antiviral medication? Please be very specific so we will know exactly what test to tell our doctors to run and exactly what result to look for and how to interpret it.
  18. Nathan

    Nathan New Member

    You're using the iPhone again, aren't you, June?
  19. June-

    June- New Member

    How could you tell? :D
  20. Henrysullivan

    Henrysullivan New Member

    Round and round and round we go, where we stop, nobody knows...

    Irelandman, if I understand you correctly, you indicate that Stephen has given you some very useful information to use in your quest to relieve your symptoms. Questions for you:

    (1) Specifically what information has Stephen given to you, which you have been able to take advantage of, and which has led to symptom relief?


    (2) Can you please describe the symptom relief you have had?

    Thanks very much!


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