Pubmed - Vasopressin exposure in rats - Kidney/Ear relationship

Hey Cheese,

One more question - Do you know of any herbals out there that may influence vasopressin?

Tim M

 

Hi Cheese,

One more question...Where do you think salt and caffeine fit into this picture?

Tim M

 

This is all very interesting to me. I was supposed to see a nephrologist a year ago and just didn't go due to seeing too many docs at one time. Maybe it's time to go. Do any of you get fluid retention in your ankels too? I do from time to time.

Sparrow

 

Cooooooooooo-eeeeeeeeeeeeeee Cheesie come out of hiding and answer your questions ;D
Please

Tim cAMP.....its gone, I know it but it's gone....hate that...no matter I'm sure Cheesie will be along soon ;D

Sparrow sweetie, fluid retention is my middle name Not sure if's it in this post or another but I had a bad reaction to my increased dyazide and blew up like a balloon They think I have SIADH or Syndrome of Inappropriate Antidiuretic Hormone....ie. vasopressin. It's appears to be under control now (on 2 bloody diuretics )

One thing I can tell you and Tim is that to me this theory is extremely promising and I can't wait till I can get my hands on the Tolvaptan.....I wonder how long before it comes downunder ??? I have my doc all primed : and keep mentioning the drug to him...if anyone will get it for me, he will

Maggie

 

Sorry for the lateness guys.....been lazy ....as usual

G'day Tim. Yes mate, you're right. Tolvaptan is currently in trials for congestive heart failure. It's also in trial for hyponatremia, and polycystic kidney disease.

I really don't know mate. The FDA has allowed the drug to be fast tracked for treatment for polycystic kidney disease.

You can read about the fast track here. http://www.pkdiet.com/pdf/TolvaptanOtsukafasttrack.pdf ....fast track status was granted early last year, so would think that trials would be close to finishing. It could be months, or it could be a year or two.

What I don't know is though, is if this drug is FDA approved for kidney disease, i'm not sure if they are able to prescribe this for other conditions(mm) until proper trials have been undertaken for each individual condition. I'd love to know the answer to this.

Absolutely. Vasopressin is like your bodies own protection mechanism. If you're losing fluid from the runs, your body would defintiely trigger vasopressin release. It helps minimize dehydration in situations like you mentioned. I would say you would release alot more vasopressin during bad spells of dirrhea than during garden variety nausea. Whether this effects the inner though is still not really proven though(unfortunately). But if there is a vasopressin link to meniere's, you would think that anything that stimulates the vasopressin could and would mess with your meniere's.

I'm really not sure mate. Drinking alot of water can supposedly decrease the amount of vasopressin. A forum member who used to post here name, Fred, also mentioned that alcohol is an ADH antagonist also. Maybe a glass of red each night could be helpful, without being a miracle cure.

There was a japanese study where they made patients drink 0.35ml of water per kilogram in body weight each day. It was a very weak and underdone study, but it's purpose was to try and reduce Anti-Diuretic-Hormone in the blood. I tried it out, but found it to be dangerous considering how low my current salt intake was.

Not real sure mate. My take on salt is that it helps by keeping fluid retention as minimal as possible. If our ears already have a fluid re-absorption problem, I think eating too much salt would just stress an already stressed system further.

On caffeine, I'm not real sure. It may have some molecular properties that inhibit ions in the ear or something, but I personally think that the problem just comes from its stimulant properties. If your ear is already firing bad signals to the brain, I think consuming caffeine is just like turning the volume up on those signals, which leads to things like vestibular hypo-sensitivity, and louder tinnitus. I'm just talking shit here though, lol, I really have no idea about caffeine to be honest. The above theory makes sense to me though, whether it's right or not, i really don't know.

 

cAMP stands for Cyclic adenosine monophosphate. You can read about it here on wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclic_adenosine_monophosphate ...seems to be some sort of cellular transport mechanism. Not real sure how it ties in with it all though.


Maggie ...glad to hear the dual pizz tablets are finally doing the trick

I'll let you all know if I find out anything more. I hope it can help us all. I've just turned bilat, so anything that can kick this thing in the arse before i'm deaf as a post would be a life saver.


And apologies for the previous novel.

 

Hey Cheese - Again great info! I printed out each of the links and I am going to give them to my ENT. If you hear of any new info on this please post it.

What's the deal with .35 ml of water per kilo of body weight. Will this slow down the release of vasopressin? Does it work?

Thanks - Tim

 

Hi again, Tim.

You can ready the abstract to the water study here,

Water may cure patients with Meniere disease

It seemed to work for a couple of people in this study, but I wouldn't get your hopes up. It seems weak considering the small amount of people involved etc

Also be careful with drinking excessive amounts of water though. It can give you problems far worse than any vertigo attack. The 0.35ml per kilo should be safe though.

 

And yep, in theory it's supposed to correct an over-active vasopressin problem.

 

Cheesie :-* did I miss it or are you just now saying you are bilateral ??? ??? ???

When did that bloody happen I am soooooooooooo sorry mate, what a bummer. Has life been rough on you? and what is Prof Gibson saying you should do ???

Wishing you the best, don't let the ba*tard get ya down :-*

How's Cosmo?

Maggie

 

Hey Cheese - Have you ever come across any relationship between very bad anxiety and release of vasopressin? My very bad times that I have had hydrops, I've been under extreme stress and was suffering from major anxiety attacks.

Thanks again,

Tim

By the way - I'm confused are you an Aussie or a Yankee?

 

Hey Cheese,

Whats the deal with drinking too much water. How can too much water screw me up?

Also, what is the conversion from metic to english. I'm figuring about 3 ounces per 1 mililiter?

Thanks again,

Tim

 

Hi Maggie.

Went Bilat about a month ago. Seeing the prof next month to make it official, but healthy ears don't sound like firecrackers. I don't think there is much else they can do though, but I'll see what he says. Either way, I'll live.

Comso is doing good ...still a little shit though

Tim: I don't really know the answer to your anxiety question. I have read some evidence of there being links, but it is very vague. Supposedly vasopressin injected into rats created anxitey in them. But I also read something that found it not to be the case.

Google "water intoxication" ......If you drink too much water, something called hyponatremia can happen. Your blood sodium concentratyion goes down, and it can be very serious. You have to drink ALOT of water though. 8 or more litres I guess.

 

Cheese and Tim

About the anxiety issue--doesn't it make sense that anxiety would have an effect since the adrenals are right there above the kidneys? I don't get the details, but in the big picture it makes sense.

N

 

Tim.....he's an AUSSIE ;D ;D ;D