"Drop attacks are not a symptom of Meniere's but could be caused by a TIA"

This is what my consultant told me yesterday when I described a recent drop attack to him. A TIA is a Transient Ischemic Attack ie a mini stroke. He has referred me to a neurologist and looked really concerned.

Does anyone have any experience of this? Surely all those MM sufferers who have drop attacks cannot be having TIAs?

 

Do not believe so. I expect it is a variant nerve impulse crossing over to the balance nerve pathway in the brain stem. Movement of the neck could cause that if your neck is misaligned or if you have weak discs, which themselves could becaused by a misalignment that persists or from upper cervical trauma. Have you ever had any upper cervical trauma?

 

Thanks Henry. I haven't had any accidents or issues with my neck, although when I had a major onset of attacks last summer, this was accompanied by a really stiff and sore neck/shoulder, despite not having injured myself. You have very kindly advised me on NUCCA in the past, and perhaps now is the time for me to see Heidi Grant. Having not had a spin since January, I feel confident about the JOH/SERC working on the dizzy attacks but perhaps I need a different approach to the drop attacks.

 

When my neck was screwed up, I had what would have amounted to a few drop attacks, albeit each time I was in the car, fortunately, stopped at a light or parked, almost providential. I like to think that anyway. Within a few moments it would pass. The last time it occurred, I wrote about last spring. This was after I had had a collision playing basketball of all things. By neck was not right for a good couple of weeks and I kept putting it off to go to the chiropractor. Yes, I do that too. I was about to get out of my truck, parked. I turned my neck to the left and immediately it was like double vision. I had no control over my eyes. I stopped straightaway and looked forward. I closed my eyes for about a minute and opened them. It had passed. I called the NUCCA office and told them I was on the way. As it turns out, my adjustment had been knocked to kingdom come playing basketball. He adjusted me back and I have been fine ever since. I had other such incidences when I was finding my way through the maze of Meniere's information while I still had the symptoms. So I am familiar with this first hand. And what I tell you is the only thing that I can imagine it is. For folks who read this, I don't make this stuff up. I never do. I have solid reasons, based on experience, research and the validity that comes from curing these symptoms, for me to suggest to Pamina and others what I do.

 

My neuro differentiated between the two. In a TIA there is usually loss of consciousness. In a drop attack, there is not, nor is there any dizzyness or vertigo.

 

I totally agree with tumbleweed.

Both my Oto and Neurologist told me the exactly the same. I've had several sudden drop attacks but never lost my consciousness.

A question for Pamina: What motivated you to register with the nick Pamina? Mozart's master piece opera Die Zauberfloate (known as The Masonic Opera) is my favorite.. As you probably know, Pamina is the daughter of The Queen of The Night, whos asks her to murder Sarastro after he abducted her.. This scene leads into one of the most difficult and beautiful arias ever written: "The Queen of The Night"

Bravo Mozart!!!!Bert

 

Exactly

 

Henry your experience with what you say is a drop attack is not my interpretation of what a drop attack is. To me, your experience seems like a positional vertigo problem brought on by your neck movement. I have this happen to me alot, with the visual problems and vertigo, and I don't consider it to be a drop attack.

From what I understand of drop attacks, it is a sudden drop to the ground without warning, without loss of consciousness and without dizzyness/vertigo.

I would be interested in hearing from the drop-attack people here as to what they believe a drop attack is so that we are not confusing what exactly a drop attack is.

 

I have just recently experienced these "drop attacks" & did not lose consciousness. It doesn't feel as though I am falling to the ground. Instead, it feels as though the ground rises up to smack me in the face. My neurotologist said these were drop attacks.

 

Jakemax, that is exactly what happened to me. I was standing up and then all of a sudden it was as if the floor came up and I was tipped upside down. I fell straight to the ground. I didn't feel dizzy before or after the attack. As soon as I hit the floor I was fine, so I don't think I passed out or lost consciousness, there's no way I could have.

I think I'm just unlucky with the Doctor I saw yesterday (he dismissed my suggestion that I try anti-virals, saying that they are only prescribed in the US because SERC is not approved - NB I am in the UK) I will wait and see what the neurologist says. Luckily I have a good friend who is a senior professor of neurology so I can ask him if he has any experience of this.

Bert - I chose the nickname Pamina because it was the name of my first cat (we had 2 cats, one was Pamina, the other one Figaro, so you can see the Mozart connection!)

 

That is a good question, Caroline. I just know that if I had been standing, I would have dropped to the ground. Each time I lost all sense of balance. This happened to me about 3 or 4 times, each time, fortunately, sitting. If standing, I would not have been 'thrust' to the ground; but I would not have been able to remain standing and would have hit the ground one way or the other. So yes, drop attack folks, please chime in and describe what happens to you. Regardless, however, there is a reason for these symptoms. I expect that the reason for my experiences are very likely the reason for similar neurological symptoms. All of a sudden the flow of normal neurological activity is interrupted. An impingement in the brain stem seems a likely place to look.

 

Seems there are a number of reasons that can cause drop attacks. Including migraine (its not about headaches).

""Brief, nonspecific loss of consciousness - fainting - in otherwise healthy persons probably results from migraine far more than is recognized. When migraine causes fainting, the activating system in the brain stem that regulates the brain's wakefulness malfunctions as a result of transient constriction of the blood vessels that supply it."

Neurologist/migraine specialist David Buchholz from the Johns Hopkins University

 

When I have a drop attack, it's quick and simple. One minute I am standing, and the next I'm wondering exactly what the hell just happened. There is no time to feel anything. I just go down. Afterwards, the only thing lingering is any injuries I sustained in the fall. No vertigo or dizziness though, and definitely no loss of consciousness unless I hit my head (which hasn't happened).

 

Hi Pamina,

Drop attacks sound really awful. So sorry you have to deal with that.

On the side of Serc vs anti-virals, I think your doctor is out to lunch. I'm on both. They do different things. To make sure I got a good reception from my GP, I e-mailed him PDFs of the abstract list of studies relating viruses and MD, as well as a PDF compiling people's experiences on anti-virals. It might be worth trying again. Here they are:

http://www.papadisc.com/Menieres_Etiology_Viral.pdf

http://www.papadisc.com/Menieres_Efficacy_AntiViral.pdf

Best wishes, Will

 

I don't think I've ever had a drop attack, but I've had that loss of balance feeling ... more than just a little dizzy spell, I mean. For me it has always happened when I'm either ascending or descending the stairs in our house - it's like suddenly I'm walking in space or something ... like the next step has disappeared & I barely catch myself before falling. Kinda hard to describe & I never actually fall, so I hesitate to say it's a drop attack - especially considering what you guys have talked about here - yeesh!

 

So am I to understand that while conscious, one loses all motor control and drops to the ground? I definitely did not have that. I had motor control. Tara and others, do you lose motor control, if just briefly?

 

Yes, I lost all control, just momentarily. I also had a drop attack whilst sitting - I was sitting on a bench with a table in front of me, so I fell sideways. Again, just momentarily and I caught myself before I actually hit my head on the bench. At that time I was in the midst of a spate of attacks, so I did feel dizzy after, but I think that was not related to the drop attack but to the shock and horror (the drop attack happened at a client meeting when we were trying to win some new business) and also to the ongoing dizzy attacks.

 

I was having almost one every day. There was no protecting or catching myself, no unconsciousness. Sitting down, laying down or walking, there was no rime or reason for it just "snap" and I was down.

They ended very quickly with no residual dizziness or effects, with the exception of counting my teeth a few times.

I remember thinking with the first drop attack that I had,, So this is what its like to die.

 

Yet remain conscious and be immediately ressurected.

 

Pamina, I am very curious to know how NUCCA would affect your drop attacks. Various brain stem disoders are affected by this treatment, many of which relate to various functions of the 12 cranial nerves that attach thereto. For example, my momentary double vision experiences relate to the functions of the optic nerve and perhaps others that deal with the eyes. My wife's momentary electric shock to her face and teeth episodes relate to the trigeminal, another cranial nerve. And hearing and balance symptoms relate to the 8th cranial nerve. What is common in these nerves is that they all reoprt to the brain stem just above the first vertebra, a bone that can move and become misaligned, impacting the brain stem and all that attach to it. So yes, I am very interested to know how this treatment might affect your drop attacks.