Autism, mercury and...Meniere's?

ok, spill it for the rest of us dummies, what's the difference ?

 

I believe one has more Carbon/ Hydrogen group than the other; but don't quote me. I'm too lazy to look it up lol. I'm SO glad I got my flu shot; I take public transportation and take care of the elderly.

 

You know in my part of the country, only a century ago, women used to decorate crystal glasses with real gold by hand. Real gold with lead in it. They would lick the tips of the paint brushes to make a fine point and end up with lead poisoning or so I am told. I have some of those pretty glasses but I don't use them for fear of a child or pregnant woman getting a bit of it. Probably not a real risk but I don't take a chance. I'd always worry.

 

DH never gets a sore arm and I always do. It's nothing wrong with the shot, it's something wrong with me. Or I like to think my immune system is just more discerning than his. Plus this nurse is just a terrible shot giver, though a very nice person.

 

Thanks, I knew I should have taken chemistry but I will just have to rely on those who did.

 

The EPA has limits on exposure to methylmercury, NOT ethylmercury. Methylmercury is a proven neurotoxin and accumultaes in the body. Ethylmercury is what is used in thimerosal, and the studies have shown that it neither accumulates in the body like methyl does and there is no accepted evidence that it acts as a neurotoxin in the doses used in vaccines.

 

Thanks. Do they both roll around in little slippery silver balls ?

 

Eli Lilly and Co. supposedly answered this question for us back in 1930. Concluding thimerosal to be of "a very low order of toxicity . . . for man," the company hired its own doctors to perform thimerosal experiments in Indianapolis City Hospital on meningitis patients during a severe outbreak in 1929. [The patients all died within days, but thimerosal was reported as being safe.] This 60-year-old evidence was still quoted on the company's brochures as recently as 1990. Andrew Waters, who is involved in a lawsuit against Eli Lilly, claims that most critical studies on the toxicity of thimerosal were suppressed by the company until now.

That might explain why thimerosal was eliminated in many countries 20 years ago. In 1977, a Russian study found that adults exposed to ethylmercury, the form of mercury in thimerosal, suffered brain damage years later. Studies on thimerosal poisoning also describe tubular necrosis and nervous system injury, including obtundation, coma and death. As a result of these findings, Russia banned thimerosal from children's vaccines in 1980. Denmark, Austria, Japan, Great Britain and all the Scandinavian countries have also banned the preservative.
Eli Lilly stuck to its "scientific" facts, but the truth began slipping between the cracks in 1999. After the number of immunizations rose to 12 to 15 per child, the public finally became privy to the possible dangers of thimerosal. One 1999 study revealed that some infants, due to a genetic or developmental factor, lack the ability to eliminate mercury. Trace amounts of mercury in these infants, when accumulated over several vaccines, could pose a severe health risk. Some vaccines, such as vaccines for hepatitis B, contained as much as 12.5 micrograms of mercury per dose. That's more than 100 times the EPA's upper limit standard when administered to infants.

...In June 2000, federal officials and industry representatives were assembled by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to discuss the disturbing evidence. According to Tom Verstraeten, an epidemiologist who had analyzed the data on the CDC's database, thimerosal appeared to be responsible for a dramatic increase in autism and other neurological disorders. Verstraeten told those at the meeting that a number of earlier studies indicate a link between thimerosal and speech delays, attention-deficit disorder, hyperactivity and autism.
Verstraeten offered no possible cause for this correlation, but held that the statistical evidence linking vaccines and neurological disorders was strong. Dr. Bill Weil, a consultant for the American Academy of Pediatrics, and Dr. Richard Johnston, an immunologist and pediatrician from the University of Colorado, presented similar concerns to the group. However, given no causal relationship, the CDC and industry representatives were quick to discredit the evidence.

Consequently, the CDC paid the Institute of Medicine (IOM) to conduct another study on thimerosal. According to Robert F. Kennedy Jr., this study was fixed in order to "whitewash" previous findings. In its 2001 report, the IOM's Immunization Safety Review Committee did conclude that the link between thimerosal and neurodevelopmental disorders was biologically plausible, though the evidence neither proved nor negated it. The Committee stated that phasing out thimerosal from vaccines was “a prudent measure in support of the public health goal to reduce mercury exposure of infants and children as much as possible.” However, these findings offered no imperative. The data presented at the 2000 meeting was withheld from publication and the link between thimerosal and autism remained "inconclusive."



From naturalnews.com

 

I'm not sure I've ever seen a ball of either

 

One of the few researchers who studies the effects of ethyl mercury is Thomas Burbacher, PhD, professor of environmental and occupational health sciences and director of the infant primate research lab at the National Primate Research Center, University of Washington, Seattle. Burbacher's studies of ethyl mercury and thimerosal in primates are cited by both sides of the thimerosal debate.

Burbacher says that just because ethyl mercury is gone from an infant's blood soon after it receives a dose of thimerosal -- a half-life of just 3.7 days in the Pichichero study -- doesn't mean it's gone from the body.

"Just because it came out of the blood doesn't mean it is excreted from the body. It could have gone to the brain," Burbacher tells WebMD. "In primates, you actually get more mercury in the brain after exposure to ethyl mercury than with methyl mercury -- it has an easier time crossing the blood-brain barrier."
from http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/569558

 

TM, if we stipulate that everything said above by natural news is factual and complete- and I see no reason to assume it is but for the sake of argument let's say it is - then my question is - with regard to meniers - so what? What is the correlation? Why should we turn our eyes to this substance rather than wonder if the cows got into the snakeroot or a million other possibilities. Poisonous substances abound and if you ever saw where your food came from and where it had been I doubt you'd be fixing on mercury. The body and liver are amazing things. We have to eat a peck of dirt before we die so why is this particular subject all the rage lately? What about every other poisonous substance in our world including but not limited to the ones nature put there.

 

Well you are crazy so we can't rule that out as a causal factor.

 

No kidding. Talk about setting the bar low there

 

How's your sister doing? Maybe you two can be a case study.

 

stupid genes

 

Maybe you ate the methylmercury and she ate the ethylmercury

 

June, the correlation is that there is a lot of overlap with autism symptoms and treatments and Meniere's symptoms and treatments.

Think about it. Most autistic kids have celiac/wheat/dairy intolerance issues, vitamin deficiencies, raging candida infections, vestibular problems, hyperacusis, nystagmus, and frequent ear infections.

I'm not saying autism and Meniere's are one and the same. I'm not saying that thimerosal is the one-and-only cause of autism, or that it is the cause of the Meniere's symptoms in anyone here on this forum.

I'm just saying, take a look at the overlap.And look at what I posted in the first post on this thread, and consider whether it may apply to some individuals with diagnoses of Meniere's.

Go ahead and wonder about a million other possibilities. That's how answers are found. Just don't dismiss the possibility of a link here until you have strong, independent proof (that does not come from those who profit from the sale of thimerosal-containing products).

If you really believe ethylmercury is safe, go ahead and inject yourself with it. Play with silver balls of mercury, and eat'em when you're bored. Knock yourself out.

 

Well, first I would have to accept that the wheat/dairy intolerance, vitamin deficiency, raging candida infections are typical of Meniere's patients. It is not an issue for me, I don't know about the majority of MM patients. I don't think there is much evidence that it is rampant among Meniere's patients although we know of some who have those issues.

Frequent ear infections are typical of allergies in general and children in general. The hyperacusis and nystagmus are things that affect people with inner ear problems. Do people with autism frequently have inner ear problems? I might look for a possible common factor whether it be genetic or environemental or who knows but I wouldn't just all the sudden think MERCURY! I still say what about those cows. Are those kids drinking milk? How many of us drank milk in our lives. WHy isn't anyone on the case of snakeroot or mad cow disease or whatever else poisons milk? To not go off on a million wild goose chases there has to be something that kind of narrows down the field other than just the popular media. Maybe it is aspartame or shoe polish or plastic or e coli or acne or skinned knees. We all have these things in common too. Who's looking in to them? Why not. Maybe it is the water. Maybe its the little pathogens that live in water that we can't get out. Maybe it is something about the lanolin in sheeps wool or maybe it's something in the alfalfa sprouts. What about them? They've been making people sick. Is that a good sick that can't have any other repercussions. What about - see 'could' doesn't narrow things down very far or advance the knowledge base on its own. Almost everything COULD be the culprit. We need more than that. That's my objection to the popular press going off on these BE SCARED of this common thing articles that are sure to sell a book but are grounded in nothing but COULD.

In fact they make me mad because they prey on parents who are trying desperately to protect their children against unknown enemies by putting up straw men for everyone to swing at while not actually moving the body of knowledge forward. They are mostly just working on their own bank balance. I'm old, I saw these things in my 20's and then a new version in my 30's and then again every decade and they will be going strong after I am dead. They are sure fire sellers and someone will always be hawking them to concerned parents trying to do the right thing.

 

I believe there are many correlations between many disorders, however, I am not sure of the causes. It has never been proven that vaceens "cause" autism, and studies are pointing more and more towards there being some genetic link as many families have patterns of autism that are being noticed now that the diagnostic standards are more broad. The DSM-IV that is used today to diagnose "mental illnesses" was updated in the early 1990's and included a larger spectrum for autism disorders. (ironicly had that been the diagnostic tool used when I was a kid I would have been diagnosed as Asperger's, a high functioning form of autism that is marked by normal or near normal language development and really poor social skills, among other things) Some people with Autism have serious sensory issues, others are more mild. These sensory issues do include major problems with the vestibular system in some of these folks. (I got to have ballance issues BEFORE mm or mav so imagine what that is like for me now: double damaged)
The corrleation people began to draw with the vaccinations and Autism came because at about 18 months or so, and this is about the same time for many vacceens, the autism sort of seemed to "kick in" and these kids were lost in a world of their own. But autism even existed in kids that did not have the vacinations, so it was difficult to draw a straight line to a "cause". Some kids are so autistic that the sensory issues cause them to be identified very early. Others its later on. The more severe, often, the more likely the child is to be identified early. It is at a point in brain development that these kids began to show the signs of Autism, and yes, it often correlates with the "normal" parts of infant-hood such as vaccinations.
Many of these kids, as do many normal kids, have sensitivities to foods. Personally, and there isnt any science to back this up, I think its a genetic thing because some Autistic kids just dont have the food sensitivities that others do. Its not a diagnostic marker for Autism or Autism Spectrum Disorders, but is often seen.
As far as MM goes, I believe that there are genetic componants that make some more likely to develop issues when exposed to viruses, or genetic markers that make it "happen". No science there, just a hunch on my part.
I know alot about Autism because my speciality is in autism for my Masters Degree in Special Education. There is a lot of research, good studies mind you, that suggest Autism is the cause of extra testrosone being present inutero or just after birth. Its Simon Baron-Choen's idea of the "exteme male mind" and although I dont buy the male mind thing, I do think some of the studies do lend themsleves to further investigation (the book "the essential difference" is one of his and is awesome)
I DO think vaccenes can be dangerous. I also DO think they can save lifes. But again, its all part of that risk we take with any medical procedure or program we are involved with. I believe there is a genetic componant to Autism. And although there isnt any research that I am aware of anyhow, I believe MM may be linked to genetics at some point. None the less its all good info for debate.

 

You make a lot of good points, June.

I didn't mean to imply that ALL Meniere's patients suffer from food intolerances, candida, etc. But a high number on this board certainly do--but many, like Henry Sullivan, obviously do not. But I've said all along in my posts here that we should not be looking at one magic bullet when there is a whole firing squad..

And I agree with you about cows. That might figure into the dairy intolerance connection, and, like I said, a huge number of autistic kids have dairy intolerances. Beef may be an issue as well, and many vegetarians point to studies linking meat from all sources as being linked with autoimmune disorders. Not sure, but I think organic (no hornmones, no antibiotics, no pesticide-laden feed, etc) meats have been included in those studies?

I also agree with you about people preying on parents of autistic children with snake oil cures. But there are also people who are truly helping people with autistic children. And it's very similar to what we see with Meniere's--what works for one child does not necessarily work for others, and doctors pooh-pooh treatments like vitamin supplements, anti-fungals, and modified diets in spite of glaring scientific evidence (such as blood tests showing intestinal malabsorption, vitamin deficiencies, autoimmune reactions to gluten and casein, etc in most autistic children who are tested). Many autistic children also test positive for heavy metal toxicity.

So I do't agree with you about "almost anything could be the culprit." There IS evidence that mercury causes major neurological problems, and is given in dangerous doses to infants, and now to pregnant women in flu shots (and flu shot package inserts recommend AGAINST being given to pregnant women!!!).

And we should go after all the other things where there might be evidence, as well. I agree with you there.