A Must Read For Those Tired of Having NUCCA Sold As The Cure for Everything

I once read a survey where they ranked Menieres in it's severest form, just below last stage cancer and AIDS. Can you imagine what it's like to simply not be able to stand your suffering for even a day ... let alone a lifetime? The ONLY thing that keeps you going is hope. Thankfully only a tiny minority get to that stage, but they will still be out there.

So if you feel obliged to continually 'protect' others by alerting them to the negatives, ask yourself whether you are also offering a positive alternative.

Lee

 

Ok I've read this whole thread, question, are you saying nassman, that people should not go to a nucca or chiro ever? I am perplexed at the topic of this thread.

 

Lee-- You have a good point. We should not just be saying don't do this because........ but we should be saying this didn't work for me but this did!

I went to a chiro for years and it didn't seem to help. I kept going back because he promised he could make it all better. Unfortunately, that did not happen. Maybe I just didn't go to a good one. Maybe there is a better one out there somewhere.

What helps me is to take a day off for myself. When I get overwhelmed(sp?) I simply tell my kids and my husband that mom is not working today. It's usually a Saturday because my husband dosen't work and someone has to make the money. My family understands and they give me that day. They cook for me, clean for me, and pretty much just leave me alone. Saturday is the quietest day in my house. Deep breathing works for me too.

Hope is the one thing that keeps us all going. Try to have hope. Prayer and Hope are very powerful tools.

HUGS TO ALL

Patsy

 

I have a very severe case of mm and never had a doctor relate it to the last stages of cancer or aids. I agree with nassman's post. Also personally I would "NEVER" go to a chrio for mm and IMO if I could make it so I didn't keep having to see the thread that got all this started I would block it!! I try and ignore it at every chance I get but saw nassman's and thought I'd throw in my 2 cents. I've never see any hard copies of any studies or evidence that would prove a NUCCA practicioner or a chiro useful in the treatment of mm.

 

Good post Nassman. I sometimes went to a chiro who was considered the best. I went for back and neck pain.

The hand treatments helped a lot. Then he switched to a newer method with an Activator. This also helped.

The he switched to another method called Networking. Very little hand or activator manipulations were done. I simply laid stretched out on a table while my body healedi tself. The method wasn't helping me and asked him to go back to the hand or activator methods. He refused and urged me to give this method more time.

I did give it more time and then became very ill with severe abdominal pain, nausea and vomiting. The chiro said this was the networking doing its job and ridding my body of toxins, Being a former health care worker, red flags went up.

I went to my internist who immediately referred me for scans and ultrasounds. I had gall stones that needed immediate attention, The surgeon removed the gall bladder and all was well.

I called this chiropractor and let him know I would not be coming back and let him know why. If I were a patient with blind faith or one who didn't know better, this could have ended up in death. He insisted this is usually not the case and his methods work in 99 percent of the cases.

Since manipulations did help, I found a different chiro. This one would immediately tell me to see my orthopedic doctor when he spotted some types of problems. The two cooperated with each other and the results were wonderful. I found a chiro I could trust. He also confided that he was formerly a patient of my other chiro and quit going there because he switched from being a good chiropractor to a quack.

There are a few good ones out there but they are far and few between. I advise all to use chiropractors with caution and I DO NOT THINK THEY SHOULD BE CONSULTED FOR MENIERES.

 

Should I be offended?

Also... if it's not a coincidence, it is a placebo??? Well, the placebo did not work for the MAV symptoms, just the MD symptoms... must be a partial placebo, maybe a time-release placebo, or only one placebo per person... But, thanks, I appreciate the analysis of my situation.

Nassman - good to see you participating in a controversy that you start. Why are you not also, then, warning people away from shunt surgery and VNS which are invasive and destroy hearing and vestibular function and don't have very stellar rates of cure. Why are you not also warning people away from ENTs who tell people to 'live with it' when there are research studies out there (that their doctors aren't reading) that could lead to hearing and vestibular saving therapies like anti-virals, allergy, and estrogen/hormone balance. I don't have hearing in my ear today because I had a quack ENT who told me to 'live with it'.

Sarita is right - "entire categories of practioners cannot be dismissed because quacks exist everywhere." Do I need to repeat my horror stories involving allopathic quacks??? It will add to your list: cardiologists, thoracic specialists, neurologists, ENTs, otoneurologists, endocrinologists, hospital nursing staffs, obstetricians, .... need I continue, there are others but I don't feel like taking any more time on this. At least five of these already listed put my life or the lives of my family at risk and, indeed, killed my SIL. Let's give these quacks equal time. Oh, and the "cure without touching" example, let's not forget the ENT who wrote in his office notes that my ear canal was unobstructed even though he never got closer than four feet.

I'm with Sarita - You've had your say; both sides have been presented. Can we just drop it and get on with trying to find health instead of who is right.

SpinininOhio

 

Amen spinininohio.

 

Wow.....I guess providing people with "the other side of an argument or theory" is now consdiered controversy. I guess I should pretend that I live in the old Soviet Union and keep my thoughts to myself rather than risk being arrested by the thought police...

Sheeesh...some people....

 

Are you talking about me?!?!?!?
I'm just kidding
I know this is a serious topic but let's all lighten up a bit.
Like I said, nobody is going to change anybody's mind. The info
is to help us all make informed, personal choices.

 

whoah stop it now!

Just let folk have their say everyone please. There are two sides to every coin. Agree to disagree but for god's sake move on.

Respect everyone's view point. Read it, soak it in, dismiss it, whatever, it's your choice. But everyone is entitled to an opionion and should be able to voice it.

 

Well said chez. Thanks.


A few more points for people to subjectively think about, and then I'll move one.

1. NUCCA patients seem to be exposed to copious, and unnecessary, amounts of radiation.

2. A skilled radiologist will tell you that X-ray distortion plays a key role in making it a appear that bones have moved. A slight turn, and presto, there is your "sublaxion" ...another slight turn, and bang, it dissapears.

3. Considering that during training, people within the profession are taught some methods of patient deception, some benign, some not so, who knows what tricks they have up their sleeve in regards to point No. 2?

4. NUCCA seems to boast about their precise measurements ....So why do they precisely measure the X-ray, and then eyeball the vector on the patient? WHAT THE? SCAM?

5. If their theory was correct, I could turn myself into a quadriplegic by applying pressure to my upper spine. It seems convenient that the atlas is "weak" enough to be able to be poked gently back into place....... yet then suddenly it finds incredible strength to prevent quadriplegia on a daily basis.

6. The power of "touch" can be an important tool in producing placebo wellness. Maybe support your local struggling masseuse, who may be able help you a great deal, before spending large sums of money that could even make a neuro-surgeons blush. Just remember that it's extremely controversial technique .......A technique so controversial, that even some "normal" chiro's think they're koo koo.

7. Each to their own though.

 

Nass - I don't mean to offend, but... you know you word things in ways that lead to polarization of viewpoints. Look at your past threads; you create controversy by coming out in total opposition to something, the far end of the dichotomy, basically telling people their not quite bright for not believing your way. I was saying that normally you open those boxes and step back and let others go at it. Nice to see you in the fray.

chez57 - you're right. Maybe the placebo comment wasn't meant to infer anything. But I think it was. But.... to your point... I think I have had my say and I am moving on.

My vote: read and decide for yourself. You're a grown up, capable of making decisions right for you. Focus on getting well.

SpinininOhio

 

Questions for Nass and cheese. What exactly are you saying?

I don't see that you are presenting the other side of an argument. You seem to be saying that people should not try Nucca because it is dangerous.

Are you actually saying Nucca therapy does not work?
People should not try this treatment?
Are you saying that I haven't been helped by Nucca?
My relief is a result of a placebo?

Can you really say with authority that Nucca does not work? Why take such extreme position on something that you can't prove.

If others on this board state that the treatment works for them why not just say "hey good for you, I'm glad but be careful" Why bash the treatment so completely and thoroughly. Why not offer something positive.

I just don't get you guys (or gals).

 

I think Chiropractors are like Amway sales people.

 

Milo, fair enough. If it works for you and others, who am I to say that it didn't?! I'm glad it has helped you and others, whatever it may be.

I'm just highly skeptical of the science of it, or lack thereof. As i keep saying, if their theory was right, people would be breaking their necks just by washing their hair.

I myself can't, I'll concede that. The same way NUCCA practitioners can't say with any authority that it does work. It doesn't stop them charging $300 a visit for something that in no way has been proven to work though...... I wonder how many would concede that it's a totally unproven science?! Even the very core of chiropractory which is subluxation's is still massively debatable and unproven 100 years on.

Maybe I should just say "good for you" and let it slide..... It's no doubt the more polite and appropriate thing to do....I can't help but think that by saying that people aren't hearing the other side of the story though. In my eyes it encourages people to spend their hard earned on something that seems to be an expensive placebo. It's the same as people getting duped into spending big money on homeopathic remedies without even knowing what they actually are, and how they're supposed to work. Once people know what it is that they're taking or doing, if they still chose to to do it or take it, then fair enough.

Hank seems to be spruiking 100% success rate claims which truly are ridiculous ...surely any measured person can see that. That is what has stopped me from going "good for you" .....My responses a couple of months ago were much more measured.

But yeah ...whatever floats your boat and gets you felling better. Each to their own.

 

For the record; Everyday I dabble in something else that could also be just an expensive placebo.

I use the Meniett. I understand that it could be a placebo, but I still chose to use it because I think it makes a difference.

However, the Meniett does have a lot of documented evidence, including the gold standard double blind placebo controlled study backing it's use.

I read both sides of the argument, and still chose to use it. How is this any different?! ..Nucca shouldn't be immune to criticism and debate.

 

Cheese, although you may somehow infer that, never have I said that, nor have I implied that. What I have said numerous times is that I believe that more times than not Meniere's is brought on by a misalignment of the first vertebra. I have given my reasons. Many people here have the same experience I have and have been helped by what I have brought to this forum. The idea that I am somehow "selling" chiropractic necessarily implies that I have a profit motive. That is silly and can in no way be substantiated. Can we not offer to people the best of our knowledge and experience and let them decide? I trash no other remedies. Why do you trash mine. I am well; I am cured of this beast. Once I was not. I am well for one reason, and that is the fact that I sought and received appropriate chiropractic care for what turned out the be the cause of my Meniere's. Why is that not a good thing to spread to others so that if perhaps they have the same problem, they can find a remedy? Much of this truly mystifies me.

Still, I wish you all good health,

Hank

 

My ex-husband's aunt was seeing a chiropractor (this was years ago). He told her he could cure diabetes. She had it really bad. She stopped taking her insulin and was seeing him daily. Needless to say, she almost died.

 

Fair enough, Hank. 100% may have been an exaggeration on my part. I apologise. I do notice the use of "100%" in quite a few of your posts. Maybe it's not directed at cure rates though. However, this is an example of what has riled me up.

There is no "in my opinion" in that post. You categorically state that meniere's can be cured in most cases by chiropractic. That is simply not true, Hank.

If it has helped you, by all means post about your positive experience. But you have to understand that such a dubious science is going to raise skepticism in a lot of people.

Maybe nucca did help you?! I can't say with 100% bulletproof certainty that it didn't. It is well documented however that placebo treatments have been shown to have a positive effect on Meniere's patients. I also know that after many years of suffering, my pop had a spontaneous remission that lasted about 40 years.

I'm sure we could argue it till we're blue in the face, and it'd no doubt be a pointless outcome. Just keep posting what you believe and think, and I'll do the same. It's an over used cliche, but people can make up their own minds.

 

Shocking. And that is the common mindset of chiropractic. They don't believe that they are simply able to help manage symptoms. They base their whole "science" on the ability to "cure". It's a dangerous god complex which could, and no doubt has, lead to dangerous misdiagnosis.