2.7 trillion medical bill

Discussion in 'Your Living Room' started by Intrepid, Jun 3, 2013.

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  1. Intrepid

    Intrepid New Member

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/02/health/colonoscopies-explain-why-us-leads-the-world-in-health-expenditures.html?hp&_r=0

    I wonder how much surgeries for Meniere's Disease and medical treatments cost in other countries.
     
  2. shartsoe

    shartsoe New Member

    TIME Magazine recently ran an article titled "Bitter Pill: Why Medical Bills are Killing Us." In it, the author uncovers the drivers that make health care in the United States so much more expensive than in other developed countries. I think before we can have any rational discussion on single payer health care, we need to first look at those things which make health care such a staggering cost. Perhaps if health care costs were somewhere closer to what they should be, insurance would be more affordable for more people (or not needed at all except in the case of catastrophic illnesses.)
     
  3. June-

    June- New Member

    Big issue in the US that we need to come to terms with.
     
  4. jimmykicker

    jimmykicker New Member

    Preach on sister...St. Vincents in Birmingham Alabama sent BCBS a bill for my MRI....$6287! WHAT!?!? Of course they only paid them $1500...The otologist billed them three steroid shots....$2600 each...yes. They paid like $1200. Can someone explain to me how that is not robbery? I mean if I want to be robbed, I will just stand on the corner in downtown Birmingham at 3 in the morning waving wads of $100 bills in the air.

    This is a major soapbox for me. Where does the provider get off on charging anybody that kind of money for a service like that? Let's just say I didn't have insurance...they would expect me to pay them $15,000? Well hell....why can the insurance company say screw yall, all we are paying is $4100 total....but because you didn't have insurance they would expect you to PAY $15,000? Is the balance of this what the medical industry is alway crying about? About how they didn't collect their outrageous charges they inflicted on someone that could NEVER pay them back?? So....that being said...just HOW much of the dollar amount is it that they are REALLY not getting from the uninsured that they are always crying about? What's the REAL numbers?? Not the frivilous charges they so easily dish out?? I mean a REALISTIC amount....like what the insurance company is actually paying? In otherwords...how is that number related to REAL world charges?

    I for one am not a big fan of socialized medicene, and that's not something I want to discuss on here...at all, but it seems really strange to me about how we are putting the cart before the horse when it is clear there is a LOT of price gouging in the medical field. Pay up or die? That is where I think the majority of the problems are lying...

    How is this even LEGAL? It's like borrowing money from loan sharks.

    Sorry guys....I'm calming down now... whew!
     
  5. shartsoe

    shartsoe New Member

    It's the "chargemasters" fault. (Read the article -- it really is amazing).

    I am also not a fan of socialized medicine, but it is clear that something has to change. I've seen far too many people who can't afford to play the game get lost in the shuffle, while people like me (with pretty good insurance coverage) get taken for a ride. (One time doctors kept my daughter in the hospital for four days with a respiratory virus because I had Kaiser Permanente, but discharged an infant of a similar age, with the same virus because she had a lesser paying insurance plan. I only know that because I talked to her parents.)

    Read the article. You'll be amazed.
     
  6. Vicki615

    Vicki615 New Member

    I too am Not for socialized medicine. I think the best idea I have heard so far, to help keep costs down which would in turn make health insurance more affordable, is for here in the USA to let people choose providers from any state. That would open up the market to alot of competition, competition usually keeps prices down and quality up.
     
  7. jimmykicker

    jimmykicker New Member

    ^^^hitting the like button...
     
  8. bulldogs

    bulldogs New Member

    Malpractice insurance is outrageous. Doctors are afraid to get sued from frivolous lawsuits.
    My girlfriend recently returned to practicing medicine as our youngest son is now going in 1st grade and no kids at home and you would be amazed at how much money it costs for her to insure herself for her services.


    Doctors do not take home as much money as you think. They have horrific overhead. Nurses, rent, supplies, equipment (x-machines, mri machines....)insurance, secrataries, office help ect.....

    I would not want tI be a Dr. In today's environment. Many are leaving the profession.

    Insurance and lawyers are the reason our medical bills are outrageous as well as not being able to buy insurance across state lines. In other words Competition.
     
  9. June-

    June- New Member

    It's not the doctors, nurses etc, it is the rest of the businesses that make their,living off health care.
     
  10. CarolineJ.

    CarolineJ. New Member

    It's funny how many posters above mentioned they are not for socialized healthcare as though it is a bad thing.

    As a Canadian I can't imagine anything else. :)

    I guess it's all what you are used to.
     
  11. June-

    June- New Member

    Many people do not understand what it is. Many who are against socialized medicine are adamant that they dont want any changes to Medicare.
     
  12. Intrepid

    Intrepid New Member

    The problem is with the word "socialized." I think several people who are against the type of healthcare that exists in Canada and Europe haven't fully understood what it actually involves. I've had conversations with people who interchange the world socialized with socialism and communism and all types of -isms they can come up with. They've never actually learned anything about healthcare systems in other countries nor have they used it.It's not American so it's got to be sinister in some way.
     
  13. bulldogs

    bulldogs New Member

    I support healthcare for everyone, just don't let the government control it. They cannot run anything efficiently. Look at the post office, getting a drivers license, the IRS, public education social security (bankrupt) ect.......

    I accept the premise healthcare should be for everyone, but why have the gov't run it, everything they touch becomes a total disaster and failure.

    Can u say Flat Tax!
     
  14. Vicki615

    Vicki615 New Member

    I agree with Bulldog, the gov't should not control healthcare, for those same reasons he listed. I have many friends in the UK and Canada and have spoken to them about their healthcare system. To assume we do not know anything about it because we are against it is an inaccurate assumption.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2011/12/19/the-ugly-realities-of-socialized-medicine-are-not-going-away-3/

    "The NHS is broken — and not in some superficial way that a simple tweak would fix. The incentives are wrong. The government’s main priority is keeping costs low — not providing quality care. Patients can’t choose how they receive their care — it’s one-size-fits-all medicine. And the entrenched NHS bureaucracy has no reason to improve efficiency.

    The problems with “universal” health care aren’t confined to Britain. Canada’s single-payer, government-run system — where any private health care is outlawed under the Canada Health Act — is similarly failing its patients."
     
  15. Vicki615

    Vicki615 New Member

    "A report released in October by Britain’s health regulator found that a stunning 20 percent of hospitals were failing to provide the minimum standard of care legally required for elderly patients.

    As part of the study, inspectors dropped by dozens of hospitals unannounced. They found patients shouting or banging on bedrails desperately trying to get the attention of a nurse. At one hospital, inspectors identified bed-ridden patients that hadn’t been given water for over 10 hours.

    The upcoming austerity measures will only amplify maladies like these."

    "Many Canadians travel to the United States and pay out of pocket for treatments and procedures, as they feel the wait in Canada is too long and harmful to their health.

    The American health system is far from perfect. But it’s wrong to think that government can fix it. The socialized systems found up North or across the Atlantic are proof. We need more market forces in our medical sector — not more government controls."
     
  16. bluespurs

    bluespurs New Member

    As a uk resident, I often dont know if I should laugh or cry at what US citizens have to pay. But no waiting lists? well not like here. Lots of money in healthcare in America, please correct me if Im wrong but isnt healthcare responsible for about 25% of your GDP.
    NHS in the UK is heading towards going private, inch by inch its all evaporating thanks to the Tories.
    I always put it down to how it affects me, waiting lists for ENTS etc in the past and this and that drove me nuts. Soon as I bit the bullet and went private my life became a lot easier, money talks. the rest is all forgotten.
     
  17. shartsoe

    shartsoe New Member

    This is not true. I have read a great deal about government sponsored health care. Here in the US anyway, it was presented as an answer to rising insurance costs -- one that would cost taxpayers nothing and be good for businesses. Well, the version of the Affordable Care act that actually passed has turned out to be anything but affordable for either businesses or individuals. One of my good friends hails from Denmark -- where they have government sponsored everything -- preschools, daycare, health care, you name it they have it. They also pay upwards of 65% in taxes and have very little actual choice.

    To say that Americans don't like it simply because it isn't American (and therefore somehow sinister) paints us with a broad brush, does it not? I don't like it because it is not the government's job to take care of me. Are there things I would like about it? Yes, primarily that those who need help would be able to get it. Beyond that, I can't see one single benefit to either businesses or to individuals. The system we have isn't perfect, but for someone like my cousin who has Cystic Fibrosis, a government sponsored heath care system like in England or Canada would be disastrous. There are days when she needs a chest X-Ray today, not tomorrow, not next week, not two days from now. We are incredibly fortunate that we have near immediate access to goods and services that lead to a healthier outcome for some people.
     
  18. shartsoe

    shartsoe New Member

    And, I apologize. Ray has asked that we refrain from politicizing on this board and I think I may have overstepped. I don't want to offend anyone or create tension unnecessarily. We all have strong opinions when it comes to these things.
     
  19. Intrepid

    Intrepid New Member

    As I said in my post, "the people I've had conversations with" expressed these views and I added my opinion. I wasn't encompassing all people all over and certainly not anyone on this thread.
     
  20. shartsoe

    shartsoe New Member

    Okay, my apologies. I certainly didn't think you were maligning anyone here.
     

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